YFP 379: Inspiring Bold Ideas: Career and Entrepreneurial Insights with Dr. Brooke Griffin

Dr. Brooke Griffin, founder of Bold Idea Group, shares her career journey in pharmacy academia to launching her own coaching business. 

This episode is brought to you by First Horizon.

Episode Summary

In this inspiring episode, Tim Ulbrich introduces Dr. Brooke Griffin, a coach, mentor, and founder of Bold Idea Group. Dr. Griffin shares her career journey in academia to eventually launching her own business, and opens up about the challenges and triumphs of her path, including the bold steps she took and valuable lessons she has learned along the way. 

This conversation is packed with practical wisdom for anyone seeking career fulfillment and personal growth. Whether you’re just starting your career or looking to make meaningful changes, Dr. Griffin’s journey and insights are sure to inspire you to take bold steps toward your own growth.

About Today’s Guest

Brooke Griffin, PharmD, BCACP is a Professor of Pharmacy Practice and Vice Chair of Clinical Services at Midwestern University College of Pharmacy, Downers Grove. With over 20 years of experience in various ambulatory care clinics, she has worked on several multidisciplinary teams and precepted hundreds of students and residents.

She is a Professional Coach in Life & Work and is passionate about offering career support through a thought-provoking and creative process. She is a coach and mentor through several pharmacy organizations and speaks nationally on various professional development topics, including the importance of coaching and mentoring, time management, and work/life integration.

In 2022 she launched Bold Idea Group with a mission to inspire bold ideas from within. Her motivational podcast, Today’s Bold Idea, offers a five minute inspirational boost to start your day. She is on this self-development journey alongside all of you and believes “every pharmacist deserves a coach.”

Key Points from the Episode

• Introduction and Overview [0:00]
• Upcoming YFP Webinar [0:33]
• First Horizon Home Loan Information [1:24]
• Dr. Brooke Griffin’s Career Journey [3:23]
• Transition to Academia and Work-Life Integration [6:45]
• Challenges and Opportunities in Academia [8:58]
• Starting Bold Idea Group [23:12]
• Balancing Academia and Entrepreneurship [36:48]
• Lessons Learned and Reflections [38:30]
• Conclusion and Contact Information [43:46]

Episode Highlights

“Out of all the clients I’ve worked with, it is very rarely about leaving their current job. It’s really this job crafting aspect of thinking about is it a task that needs to be done differently? Is it a relationship that needs to be looked at differently? Is it a mindset? And most of the time, it’s mindset. We always start with mindset.” – Dr. Brooke Griffin [25:32]

“Because we know that our academic careers are demanding, and we know that it’s not a nine to five job. There’s a lot of things you’re doing on nights and weekends to fulfill that role. And the first thing I always tell people is, whatever idea you have for a side hustle, it cannot feel burdensome because you will not last. It has to be energy giving.” – Dr. Brooke Griffin [33:35] 

“When you start a side hustle or start your entrepreneurial journey, you are learning a new language. You are taking baby steps. Everything seems new and everything seems scary, and being able to embrace that beginner’s mindset again is something that I really treasure.” – Dr. Brooke Griffin [43:08]

Links Mentioned in Today’s Episode

• First Horizon Pharmacist Home Loan
• “Aliquot Investing: Small Investments in Big Real Estate Deals” Webinar on October 7th at 9pm/Eastern 
• Griffin B, Vest K, Pohl S, Mazan J, Winkler S. Part-time and job-share careers among pharmacy practice faculty members. Am J Pharm Educ. 2014 Apr 17;78(3):49.
• Destruct Yourself Podcast with Whitney Johnson
• Bold Idea Facebook Group
• Brooke Griffin LinkedIn
• Bold Idea Group 
• Today’s Bold Idea Podcast 
• The Pharmacist’s Voice® 
• Looking for other episodes on pharmacist businesses or side hustles?
  • Episode 352: Pharmacy Innovators with Kelley Carlstrom, PharmD, BCOP
  • Episode 307: Pharmacy Innovators with Dr. Izabella Wentz (The Thyroid Pharmacist)
  • Episode 327: Pharmacy Innovators with Dr. Natalie Park (Pharmesol)
  • Episode 289: Building Pricklee with Pharmacy Entrepreneur Kun Yang
  • Episode 287: Monetizing Your Clinical Expertise with Dr. Timothy Gauthier
• YFP Disclaimer
• Subscribe to the YFP Newsletter
• Tim Ulbrich on LinkedIn
• YFP on Instagram
• YFP Facebook Group

Episode Transcript

Tim Ulbrich  00:00

Hey everybody. Tim Ulbrich here and thank you for listening to the YFP Podcast, where each week we strive to inspire and encourage you on your path towards achieving financial freedom. This week, I welcome Dr. Brooke Griffin, who is a coach and mentor through several pharmacy organizations, and speaks nationally on various professional development topics, including the importance of coaching and mentoring, time management and work life integration. In 2022 she launched her business, Bold Idea Group, with a mission to inspire bold ideas from within. During the show, we discussed her career journey in pharmacy, why and how she started Bold Idea Group, and lessons that she has learned along the way, including advice that she would give her former self, both as it relates to her academic career and starting a business. Our next YFP webinar is just around the corner on October 7, at 9pm Eastern. This free webinar titled “Aliquot Investing: Small Investments in Big Real Estate Investing” will be led by YFP Real Estate Investing Podcast co-hosts Nate Hedrick and David Bright. This webinar will explore how syndications fit into a well rounded real estate investment strategy, especially for busy pharmacists who don’t have time to source, vet and manage real estate investments. In this webinar, David and Nate will be joined by Alex Cartwright, an economist who has also led syndication projects, including one in which both David and Nate have invested themselves. You can learn more about this webinar and register at yourfinancialpharmacist.com/syndication. 

Tim Ulbrich  01:28

All right, let’s hear from today’s sponsor, First Horizon, and then we’ll jump into my interview with Dr. Brooke Griffin. Does saving 20% for a down payment on a home feel like an uphill battle? It’s no secret that pharmacists have a lot of competing financial priorities, including high student loan debt, meaning that saving 20% for a down payment on a home may take years. For several years now, we’ve been partnering with First Horizon, who offers a professional home loan option, AKA a doctor or pharmacist loan that requires a 3% down payment for a single family home or townhome for first time homebuyers, has no PMI and offers a 30 year fixed rate mortgage on home loans up to $766,550 in most areas. The pharmacist home loan is available in all states except Alaska and Hawaii, and can be used to purchase condos as well, however, rates may be higher and a condo review has to be completed. While I’ve personally worked with First Horizon before and had a great experience with Tony and his team, don’t just take it from me. Here’s what Emily from Prattville, Alabama had to say about her experience with First Horizon: “Clear communication and excellent guidance from Gail and Cindy throughout the entire process. I greatly appreciated the fact that everything was digital, because I’m allergic to paper! The ability to upload inside everything digitally made the process very efficient, which I prefer. This was by far the best mortgage process I have experienced. This is my seventh when counting refinances.” So to check out the requirements for First Horizon’s, pharmacist home loan and to start the pre-approval process, visit yourfinancialpharmacist.com/home-loan. Again, that’s yourfinancialpharmacist.com/home-loan. 

Tim Ulbrich  01:52

Brooke, welcome to the show.

Brooke Griffin  03:10

Thank you, Tim, thanks so much for having me.

Tim Ulbrich  03:13

So excited to have you here. This has been a while in the making. We ran across each other at ASHP mid year in the airport, flying home from California, and reconnected on what you’re working on, on the entrepreneurial sides of things. I said, Hey, we’ve got to have you on the podcast to share your entrepreneurial journey, and we’re going to do that, but before we get to that, tell us a little bit about your career journey, what led you into the profession, where’d you complete your pharmacy training and what your focus has been in your academic career?

Brooke Griffin  03:44

Yeah, sure. Well, thank you so much for having me. And I feel like our paths have crossed a couple of times, and even before I saw you in the airport, you were so generous with your time when we had a phone call when I was just starting this journey and thinking about how to build something while working in academia. So I very much followed in your footsteps. So thank you for going first, Tim. Or one of the first because you inspired me. You helped me a lot that day when we talked. So what got me into pharmacy? Well, I was a very confused high school student and wasn’t sure what I wanted to do, and I had a huge chip on my shoulder, and I was very stubborn, and I thought I, you know, didn’t want to go to school for very long because I was 17 and really stubborn, but I wanted to be able to support myself and have a service aspect to my job that it felt impactful. I feel like a lot of pharmacists say they wanted to help people. I think I was too selfish for that, but I knew I just wanted to have some sort of impact in my role. And so a friend of mine, her older sister, was going to pharmacy school, and back in the day before there were like, websites and virtual tours that you could go to, you would go to campuses and spend the night with an upperclassman to really get the feel. And so I just fell in love with this idea of going to school for five years and having this great degree and being in healthcare. And ended up going to Massachusetts College of Pharmacy and graduated with my PharmD, which ended up taking six years, and then added a residency to that. So my bold idea at age 17 with getting out in five years ended up being seven, but I fell in love with pharmacy, basically.

Tim Ulbrich  05:28

And that led to an academic career that you’ve been on for some time now. So tell us about your journey into academia. When did you know that was the right path for you, and what’s been your focus in that area?

Brooke Griffin  05:39

It was during APPYs. So I did an academic rotation with one of my favorite professors, Dr. Lynn Sylvia, and she really gave us a behind the scenes look at what faculty do, and it was so much more than what the student sees from the lecture hall. And she introduced us to kind of a three legged stool of teaching, service and scholarship, and all the organizations that faculty are part of, and how they really enrich their professional development continuously. And I had no idea that this was even an option for me after graduating with a PharmD and then completing a residency. So that really set me on my path. I also had a strong interest in ambulatory care, so that was also solidified during appys. So thankfully, I found a residency that combined both ambulatory care and a ton of teaching, and that was with Midwestern University. And then when I completed the residency, they offered me a job to stay on.

Tim Ulbrich  06:35

We didn’t know each other at the time, but very similar path. So I went down a residency in ambulatory care that had an academic component opened up my eyes to teaching scholarship, service, and that’s one of the things I loved about academia, is especially for those that like to create and build there are so many opportunities, whether it’s in the classroom, teaching, whether it’s at a clinical site teaching, whether it’s in scholarship teaching, even In service. Opportunities like there are a ton of ways to be entrepreneurial and build inside of an academic environment. And I think the flexibility that can be afforded there and the creativity that can be afforded there is really unlike many other roles. And you shared with me several weeks ago, and we had talked leading up to this podcast, that early in your academic career, you went to four days a week, a 0.8 full time position. Why did you decide to go down that path? What? What did that allow you to do? And how did that help pave the way for others to do that as well? 

Brooke Griffin  07:32

Yeah, it was 2009 after the birth of my first child. I had this calling on my heart to work part time, and I wanted to stay in my current role, and I felt so strongly about it that if it wasn’t going to be approved in my current role, I was seriously thinking about, what else could I do with with my career? So you know, all you can do is ask, and it was not an immediate yes. And it was a great lesson in that, you know, nothing is given, even if you are a hard worker and you feel like you’re putting incredible value in, day in and day out, your asks are sometimes not always granted. And it really surprised me thinking that it was, you know, 2009 2010, and I was really the first person to have this request. We had a couple of part time faculty who came in as part time to do some labs and workshops, and that was a little bit different. I was the first one to ask to be reduced. So it took about a year, Tim, for it to get approved through all of the appropriate channels. And if you’re in academia, you know, things take a very long time and a ton of non fillable PDFs. So you know, thankfully, I had a couple of at a mentor and my immediate supervisor, my chair, who who were supportive of me and kind of vouched for me and advocated for me and said, I know Brooke will be able to do this if she goes down to 0.8 and there were some conditions that I had to agree to, and I didn’t have Your Financial Pharmacist to lean on at the time to help me navigate that decision. So ultimately, I have no regrets. And really what it did is it gave me that work life integration that I was looking for. And for some of you who are listening, you may think, well, one day is that, was that really enough? And for me, it was. I know that there have been other faculty who’ve been able to go down to point six, and that’s the right balance for them. Point eight was the right balance for me. And so what it was able to do then is open up the door for several faculty behind me. And it wasn’t necessarily a lot easier, but it was somewhat easier. So there were two faculty that were able to put together a job share proposal. They each were point six to make up a 1.2 FTE that was really unique. And then we even published an article, Tim, that showed our productivity 18 months before going part time and 18 months going after part time. And who would have guessed it, our scholarship was way up 18 months after going part time. Because, you know, when you start a family and you have limited time in your day and then limited time on the job with being point eight or point six, you know how to get things done in the precious minutes of the day. And not that anyone is slacking off before, not to say that, but we were just able to really hunker down and fulfill our goals, regardless of the point 8 or point 6.

Tim Ulbrich  10:28

Yeah, forces and efficiency, right? That for sure. And if you’ll send us that article, we’d love to link that in the show notes. I think others would be interested in reading that, and the data helps, right? If people are thinking about making some of these proposals. I love what you shared that all you can do is ask, and even if the answer is no, doesn’t mean no forever, and it doesn’t mean that’s personal either. I mean, sometimes we’re just inside of structures and organizations where they may not be the flexibility or the creativity yet for these positions. I think we’re seeing an evolution in this space. Thankfully. I love the example you gave of two part time folks coming together for, you know, a hybrid role. And I think with the right leadership and the right conversations and the right approach, there can be a solution here, but doesn’t always mean it’s going to be on the first ask, right? And I think academic roles, the other one, I hear a lot about our VA roles – pharmacists who often will run up against barriers in proposing these types of things, but may get creative with two halftime positions, you know, replacing a full time clinical role. 

Brooke Griffin  11:29

Yeah, you’re right. And I think sometimes some leaders fear that I’m going to open the door, and the floodgates will open, and now everyone will want to request to go part time. And I can just share, from my own experience, that was not the case. There are obviously the majority of faculty who like working full time and prefer to work full time. Everyone has their own unique circumstance, and I’m thankful that they took a chance on me and that it’s been a successful model for us.

Tim Ulbrich  11:53

I have a question related to the passion that you have for your academic work, and I think this is very much going to connect to our discussion around the work that you’re doing and what you’ve been building at Bold Idea Group, your business. And the question relates to running towards something versus running away from something. I talk with a lot of pharmacists that perhaps may not be satisfied in their current role, and the desire for something else, very much as a running away from something versus running towards something. And two very different things, two very different things, from from an energy perspective, from a mindset perspective, from a motivation perspective. And one thing you shared with me several weeks ago leading up to this interview is that despite the business growth that you’ve had and the efforts that you don’t want to leave academia. That’s an area for you that has been fulfilling, that work has been able to really align with your passion, your interest, where you’re adding value to others. Tell us more about that. Where does that passion for your academic work and role come from? That it allows you to then build something else on the side as well, that you can really be moving towards that effort, not running away from what you’re currently doing.

Brooke Griffin  13:05

Yes, yeah, great question. And I talk with so many pharmacists who are going through the same thing, where they feel like they they’re running away from something. So I can definitely relate to that. I love academia. I love my faculty role. I love working with my colleagues in this space. I love working with students and the next generation of pharmacists. I love the autonomy and all of the flexibility that we talked about earlier that comes with this role, even if not all of my asks are my choice. I usually have flexibility to make it my own when I do a course or when I do a certain lecture or workshop, and for me, that’s enough. But it hasn’t been all roses. I mean, there was a time about five years ago when this all kind of started with my side business that I felt really stuck in academia. I reached all of the accolades that you could in academia, in terms of Associate Professor and full professor, I was tenure track with pretty much secured that I was going to achieve tenure, and I just hit a brick wall. And no one, no one really tells you that’s going to happen after you reach full professor. And I it was a big time of growth for me, because I didn’t realize how ambitious I was, and that when I didn’t see the next rung on that ladder that’s so well laid out in academia, that that made me really nervous, and when I realized I didn’t really want to ascend in traditional academic leadership roles, that was another sign that, Okay, what else is going to fulfill me here? I love my job. There’s certain aspects I didn’t like about it, and there were some days that I really liked my job, but the love was kind of missing. So I was feeling like I was on this constant seesaw, which made me feel stuck. And that’s when I sought out my first coach and really started asking myself some really deep, insightful, hard questions. Like, what do you want this next chapter of your career to look like? Where is your passion going to come from? And we have a word for that now, and that’s job crafting. I didn’t have that term when I was going through this on my own. I’ve kind of scrapped it together by listening to a ton of podcasts and reading a bunch of books and collecting questions and journaling at home, some of it facilitated by a coach, which was really helpful. So now I look at this time in my career where I am building something on the side that brings me immense joy, and sometimes the day job doesn’t provide all of that joy that it once did. That’s okay. I have this business on the side which is doing it for me, but there are certainly aspects about the job that I absolutely love, and I am not ready to to leave that yet. 

Tim Ulbrich  15:48

It’s interesting as you’re sharing about being stuck, you know, you’re taking back, me back and my own academic journey. And one of the things that you share that really resonates with me and maybe many listeners as well, is that often we don’t realize that there’s some of these external motivations here. We’re talking about promotion and tenure, right? Where, you know, said or unsaid in the system, we’re kind of trained to be like that’s the definition of success, right? And you see this language used all over the place, in different types of books or resources. This is not a pharmacist, academic or even a pharmacy type of thing. What we’re talking about is climbing a first mountain climbing a second mountain type of discussion. And I think when you check off those boxes, which are a necessary part of the process, they have value. And getting to that point, I think where you realize like, Hey, I’ve checked those boxes, those are all external affirmations that may or may not always align internally. And what I hear you sharing is you’re beginning to build the business, and have been building the business is there’s very much an inside out type of motivation of what you’re building and how you’re serving and helping others, and that is a whole different level of achievement, success, whatever you want to call it. You know, joy is a word that I heard, and obviously the work that you’re doing to serve others as well. So I just I love how you painted that picture. Really beautiful.

Brooke Griffin  17:07

Yeah, thank you. I think you hit the nail on the head. When I was feeling stuck and relying on some of those external validations for success, I couldn’t really name my strengths and the values that I brought to the table, and it was really hard for me to see how I was adding value every day to the job, and I realized that this is going to be an internal job to figure this out, and that’s when I made a commitment to myself that I’m going to invest in myself and figure this out. And I wouldn’t be successful in as a business owner today if I didn’t do that work, if I didn’t have such a strong idea of who I am and how I’m showing up, and what value I bring and what my strengths are, but that’s a lot of hard work of self discovery to get there, and some of us choose to stay in the discomfort and because, you know the future is uncertain, and you know we’re not sure what this is going to uncover, but I was willing to take that risk because I knew I wanted this next chapter to be fulfilling. The other thing that was really helpful to me was there was, there’s this podcast called Disrupt Yourself with Whitney Johnson. She’s got this concept of an S curve, and she says that when you reach mastery and anything that you do, you’re at the top of the S curve, and you’re you’re ready to launch, you’re ready to jump onto something new, because as humans, we need to get to the bottom of the next S curve to learn something new, to gain mastery in something and we’re constantly doing this throughout our careers. So that was really insightful for me to see. Okay, I’m at the top of my S curve. I’m ready to learn something new. I’m ready for a new challenge, and but it’s not going to be leaving my job and finding a new job. It’s going to be finding a passion project that aligns so well with my strengths and my values, and now I get to use those tools in the day job, and I get to use those tools with my business.

Tim Ulbrich  18:48

Yeah, Brooke, it sounds like as you were going through your own journey, as you described the S curve, it really forced some deep reflection questions that are big, scary questions, who am I? Who am I? What do I want? And this is why I think these earlier stages are so important that we shouldn’t…the goal shouldn’t be to avoid some of these walls we, you know, find ourselves butting up against, and some of these bigger questions that come because it’s through these moments that I think we’re afforded the opportunity for some of the self discovery. And I don’t think this ends either which is, which is beautiful, very beautiful. 

Brooke Griffin  19:24

No, you’re you’re just quickly, you’re sort of reminded me of something that there, you know during this time that I felt really stuck. I couldn’t really identify what made something a good day or what made something a bad day. I knew that I would leave with certain feelings, and so what I kind of forced myself to do was to just jot down a couple of notes at the end of each day, like what really lit me up today and what really brought my energy down. And this quick exercise, even just after a few weeks, I started to see some patterns, Tim, that it was always these types of activities that lit me up, and it was always these one or two people that really brought my energy down. So that helped me find some lanes to stay in. In terms of I’m going to push myself forward, if I’m going to do something outside of work, if I’m going to capitalize on my strengths, it’s in these areas that would be a great start.

Tim Ulbrich  20:16

And I think that’s great advice for our listeners that may be feeling some of that restlessness. Sometimes this presents as chronic irritability, chronic anger, right at this undertone type of level. But like, what’s behind that? And just journaling on it, getting curious. I love what you shared about like, what are those activities? What are the moments of the day where you feel like, regardless of time spent, you feel like it’s energy filling, bucket filling. And what are those moments and times of the day, regardless of time spent where you’re like, oh my gosh, if I had to do that for 15 more minutes, I’m gonna go crazy, right? And not to say we’re gonna find ourselves in roles that those things necessarily go away. I mean, I can even speak as making that transition from, you know, what was the dream right into owning my own business? Like, there are real challenges, there are highs, there’s lows – this is part of life. But I think being equipped with some of those things where it’s like, Hey, these are the areas that I really feel like I’m in that zone of genius, and I really can contribute and align the time I’m spending, the energy I have, with the efforts that hopefully can come out of that. I want to ask you, I think many pharmacists, and I’ll put myself in this category, as I started the business back in 2015 really struggle with the idea of making an investment in themselves in the form of something like hiring a coach. You mentioned how integral that was in your own journey, and I think there’s several factors. It’s an investment of time, it’s an investment of money, and it’s raising your hand to say, I really want to look internally and put that mirror up, right and get into some of the uncomfortable space. So how were you able to get over that hump to say that I am going to make an investment of time, of money, I am going to make this investment of self-discovery without necessarily knowing where that was going to go on the other end?

Brooke Griffin  21:59

Yeah, great question. And I think this is something that a lot of people do face, because it’s not only time, it’s money, it’s energy you have. You don’t want to pay for something, and kind of just put 50% in. So for me, it really was kind of hitting rock bottom in a professional feeling way, not in a mental health space kind of way, but in a and I don’t know where else to go. I had wonderful mentors, Tim, my entire career, I’ve been so blessed with wonderful mentors, and there was one who really just saw me for me, and could cheer me on with my triumphs, and could listen to me cry and not think I was, you know, a mess. And we got to a point where our meetings became more social. I think I just ran out of questions to ask. I didn’t know what questions to ask. And as a mentor, she wasn’t in a position where she could help me, because she’d never been there before, which that’s how mentors help us. They’ve been to where we aspire to go. So that was a big aha moment for me, that I’m going to need a different kind of career support. I’ve never had a coach before. I didn’t know how coaches could help pharmacists, but it was something I was just willing to try. I work with a lot of faculty, Tim, and for those of you who aren’t academia, a lot of faculty positions have professional development funds that the department allows you to use for books or conferences or travel. So I’ve worked with a lot of faculty who are able to use some of those funds to for that initial investment. So for anyone out there who’s considering it, that’s just something to keep in mind that we can kind of think outside of the box about how we can fund something like this. 

Tim Ulbrich  23:35

Yeah, and my personal experiences. I mean, of course, if we can get somebody to help with the bill, that’s great. My personal experiences in us, investing in resources that have helped us as we’ve grown the business, as well as our clients, investing in us is that there’s an important step of intentionality that comes when you have skin in the game. I mean, this is night and day. I know we’ve all been told this, but it really is true that, and to be clear, I have invested in coaching services that have been a clear ROI, and I have invested in other coaching services that I look back on, that they had a great learning experience, and I didn’t know all the things going into it, but it wasn’t necessarily a positive ROI, and that’s going to happen, you know, especially as you continue to make this an area priority. But when you have some skin of the game, you come with a different mindset. That’s just a matter of fact, I can tell you that over and over again from clients that we’ve worked with, whether it’s investing or student loan repayment, any part of the financial plan, when you are making that investment of time and money, you come ready, and I think that very much is going to help yield some of the results. So with that in mind, let’s talk about your business and offering the Bold Idea Group. We’re going to link to the website in the show notes. What is the Bold Idea Group? Give us a 60 commercial about the problem you’re solving and how you’re solving that problem. 

Brooke Griffin  24:53

I help pharmacists who are feeling stuck in their careers who need a different kind of career support. So I offer coaching, consulting and speaking for organizations and individuals who want something different, want a positive change in their career, and they’re not sure of the how, and through the coaching process, and through this aspect of curiosity and asking really powerful questions, and this investment of time and energy and space and holding space for people, we really figure it out, whether it’s, you know, work, life, integration, improvements, a different area of fulfillment, focusing on a specific aspect of your career. I’ll tell you, Tim, out of all the clients I’ve worked with, it is very rarely leaving their current job. It’s really this job crafting aspect of thinking about is it a task that needs to be done differently? Is it a relationship that needs to be looked at differently? Is it a mindset? And most of the time, it’s it’s mindset, we always start with mindset.

Tim Ulbrich  25:55

I mean, sometimes it’s a difficult conversation that we need to have, that we’ve been avoiding, that unlocks things going forward, right? Sometimes it’s a different perspective we’re bringing into the work culture environment. And I don’t know for some people if they hear that and they’re like, ah, darn it, like I was hoping that this would help me go, you know, to something else. But I find that very interesting, because I think it’s easy, and I’ve been in these moments, it’s easy where if we feel stuck, if we feel overwhelmed, confused, frustrated, we’re having those difficulties in the positions the grass always look greener on the other side. And I think with experience, you know, I’ve come to realize, as I alluded to a little bit ago, that there’s always challenges that’s just a part of life, and it’s our mindset of how we’re approaching those. And if we come at it with a mindset, mentality of, hey, difficult things are going to happen today or this week or this month in this season of life that’s a part of life. How do I see those, learn from those things and continue to move forward? But that doesn’t surprise me, and actually excites me that often, it’s almost helping people get unstuck in their current environments, right?

Brooke Griffin  26:59

Absolutely. Even just speaking for myself, when I started working with a coach, everything around me started changing, Tim. My, you know, definitely my approach to work, how I showed up at work, but the relationship started changing. And then I thought, wow, okay, I’m changing. I’m changing, and that’s what’s causing all of these other things to change. And it was just a total positive, level up that I needed to fuel this next chapter of my career.

Tim Ulbrich  27:30

And I would argue, Brooke, that’s richer change, right, because that’s inside out change, not outside in. I mean, we can change environments, yeah, and that may lead to some internal change, but we’re obviously changing things outside of our environment, and that may be the right move as well. But that inside out change, when you go through that self discovery, you look at the mindset, you look at, hey, how am I showing up every day? That’s going to transcend any environment you’re in which is, which is really exciting.

Brooke Griffin  27:56

Absolutely, I had, I tell the story that there was a colleague at work who I was having a lot of friction with, and I realized that I had some responsibility in that, but I just didn’t figure out what was going on, like, why there was all this friction, and our relationship has totally transformed. But, you know, we never went to couples counseling. You know, it was just I showed up differently. I was able to just approach the situation totally differently.

Tim Ulbrich  28:20

Although, to be fair, we could use a version of couples counseling in academia, right. 

Brooke Griffin  28:24

Somebody start that business, please!

Tim Ulbrich  28:26

One of the things I like to talk through with people that have built something is, where did it start? And where is it today? And we know the evolution’s not over. Of course, you’re going to continue to evolve and tweak as you find out what’s having an impact and what meets your needs as well. But for people that are thinking of an idea that maybe they have or something they want to start, whether it’s going to generate revenue or not, I think it can be very overwhelming to see someone’s current version without understanding how it’s evolved. And more often than not, it’s evolved over time, right? And it went from idea to version one to version two, version 3, 4, 5, 6 and to the current state. And there’s been things that have worked, things that haven’t worked. And the more we share that, I think it’s a breath of fresh air to say like, Brooke doesn’t have it all figured out. Tim doesn’t have it all figured out, like I’m learning. And some things work daily. Some things don’t work daily. So how does the current version look different from where you started? What has this evolution looked like in the business? 

Brooke Griffin  29:30

Great question. One of my favorite quotes by Mel Robbins is “Confidence is the willingness to try.” That it doesn’t come after you get success or after you have so many wins. Like confidence comes from trying something and realizing you’re going to get back up and try something again. And that really fueled me in the beginning, when I started thinking about, okay, what are my strengths? What are my values? What could I offer this world? Where do I want to have impact? When do I want to have impact? I started with a free group coaching program. And my quote business name at the time, even though it wasn’t an established business, was 21st Century PharmD, and it started as a weekly blog, and I had an Instagram account, and I made my own website from scratch. And I’m not a tech person, so I’m super proud of that experience. And it looked like a non tech person created a website, and the students told me that the colors hurt their eyes. I mean, it was just an awful version of a website, but I was so proud to put this thing together and publish my blog there weekly, and I started a little Facebook group where people could get personal and professional development. I thought in the beginning, like you said, the evolvement, I thought this was going to be targeted towards students, personal and professional development for students, the things you’d get outside of the classroom. And then I offered a group coaching program for students and for faculty for free, that was in 2020 and told them that I’m going to ask you for your feedback on what worked well here, and I’m also going to use this to figure out, do I like coaching? Do I like facilitating this group, and the answers to both those questions were yes, yes, people liked it, and yes, I liked it. And then working with another coach, decided, okay, what’s really next for me? And all signs were pointing to get coach training. So in 2021 I completed my coaching certification, and then in 2022 rebranded as Bold Idea Group, because I realized that all of this content I was putting out there through the Facebook group and through the weekly blogs, my peers were resonating with the content, sometimes even more than the students who hadn’t been in the workforce yet. I was really speaking to this mid career pharmacist and the mid career faculty member who just didn’t know where to go after reaching some success, but all of a sudden, felt stuck for a variety of reasons. So I rebranded in 2022 to be Bold Idea Group. And yeah, so that’s where we are today, offering group coaching and one on one coaching and more speaking engagements.

Tim Ulbrich  31:56

And I love the rebrand, but I also love the initial version for all the reasons you mentioned, right? I what I hear there is you’re sharing is that you are willing to try, you’re willing to test, your you were willing to tinker and evolve and change, and you were listening to what your audience was saying. That was a value to them. And those are some of the best businesses to build. And I think that, you know, if we think about this like an iceberg, right? Often, the first $1000, $10,000 $100,000 that a business will earn, that’s the tip of the iceberg. Oh, and by the way, what you actually see often, if you translated that to an hourly wage of time invested it took to get there, like maybe minimum wage at best, right? But all underneath the water is all of these things behind the scenes that nobody sees, and that’s why I say it’s so important when people are building something, there has to be an alignment with a very strong why and purpose with a problem you’re trying to solve, because it will grind you down otherwise. But back to what we were just talking about previously, of time that you spend that can be bucket filling energy, filling time that you spend that may be not when you’re building something that you really feel like is adding value, is providing transformation to people. I don’t want to speak for you, but I’m guessing you could write several hours on something, and there’s energy that’s coming from that, because you can see the impact that it can have. Certainly that doesn’t mitigate that. It’s hard. It takes time. There’s other priorities of how you could be spending your time, but I love to hear the evolution of that; that’s really great, 

Brooke Griffin  33:25

Yes. You know, maybe we’ll talk about this a little bit too, but a lot of faculty and pharmacists ask me about what it’s like to have a side hustle, or where do you find the time, or where do you find the energy? Because we know that our academic careers are demanding, and we know that it’s not a nine to five job. There’s a lot of things you’re doing on nights and weekends to fulfill that role. And what I the first thing I always tell people is, whatever idea you have for a side hustle, it cannot feel burdensome. Yep, because you will, it will not last. It has to be energy giving. 

Tim Ulbrich  33:56

I remember you took me right back Brooke, when I’ve got four boys now, 13 down to five, but when I started YFP, my oldest was four, my second was two, and we were just about ready to have my third. I remember them being very, very young, and late nights writing. Late nights doing webinar. But it never felt like work. It really didn’t. And, you know, it was that constant feeling of, you know, providing value, helping people along in their own journey, and just the incredible relationships that have been formed, the amount of learning I’ve been able to do from talking with individuals such as yourself. So yeah, great wisdom there, and what you’re sharing. And speaking of trying, you recently started a podcast! Today’s Bold Idea: Mindset, Motivation and Coaching for Pharmacists. We’ll link to that podcast in the show notes. What was the thought behind starting a podcast? I think that’s something that a lot of people struggle with, is I only have so much time. You know, should I be focused on social media? Should I be focused on YouTube? Should I do a podcast? What led you down that path?

Brooke Griffin  35:02

So I mentioned before that when I first started 21st century PharmD, I had a weekly blog, and I really loved that weekly blog, and I made a promise to myself, I was going to do it weekly for 52 weeks. And I did. I accomplished that goal, and then I took time off to get coaching certification, and when I rebranded Bold Idea Group, I really wanted to think about what is going to be my venue, what is going to be my forum, what is going to be my way of getting my message out there? And I realized that I wanted to try something different than blogging, and I had this whisper of starting a podcast. I did have a podcast very briefly with 21st Century PharmD, but it was all interview style. So my idea for this podcast was to produce something positive and short that someone could listen to every day before they got out of their car and walked in that door, or in between meetings when they just felt completely like helpless and hopeless. I actually started a podcast, Tim, that I was looking for –  a short, brief, positivity boost that came from someone who kind of understood this field. And there are lots of podcasts out there, as you know, I couldn’t find one that was exactly what I was looking for. And I had this, I had this joy that was coming from posting daily in my Facebook group. And I thought, Well, if that’s bringing me so much joy, I wonder what it would be like to produce it in more of an audio format. And again, let’s just try this. Let’s just throw some spaghetti on the wall and see what happens. And it’s been, it’s been really, really incredible, Tim, just I am getting messages from community pharmacists who have been a community pharmacist for 30 years, you know, telling me that they’re thankful that they’re able to listen to this, and I’m thankful that I’m a part of their day. I mean, they have so much on their plate and so much pressure. Yes, it’s a complete honor. And so we’ll see where it goes. And I’m not quite at daily yet, and I’m at three days a week, but I’m working my way there. So I also tell myself, and I say this on the podcast, is that I am taking imperfect action every day, and that’s looks. That’s a three day a week podcast when you told yourself you would produce daily. So I’m getting there.

Tim Ulbrich  37:12

I love the short form aspect of it. I was looking at your show, stream, 3, 5, 7, 9, minutes, right? Very short form content.  Inspirational. It’s vulnerable, it’s real. So I love what you’re doing there. Keep going, keep building. Thanks. I love the commitment to you know, whether it’s writing or to this, it’s so important. Because I think when you have a new idea, there’s inevitably an energy and a surge that comes you’re getting started, that eventually you will hit a point, and no matter what you’re building, anyone’s building that you’re like, What am I doing? Is this worth my time? And to really fight through that and make a commitment to yourself that I’m going to do this for a certain period of time and then reassess, you know, from there. 

Brooke Griffin  37:56

That’s right, yes, and and nothing’s a failure. You know? It’s all, it’s all building something. 

Tim Ulbrich  38:02

I do want to give a shout out here, if any pharmacist is listening, not only to check out Brooke’s show, we’ll link to that in show note, but if any pharmacist is listening that is thinking about starting their own podcast, Kim Newlove is a fantastic resource. Kim is the founder of the Pharmacist Voice, a fellow Ohioan, has some great resources available to pharmacists that are thinking of starting their own podcast. And I just love the passion, the energy she has, the way she wants to serve and help others. So we’ll link to some of Kim’s resources as well in the show notes. Brooke, let’s wrap up by doing some reflection backwards, first on your academic career, and then we’ll do it on your entrepreneurial career. As it relates your academic career, what are some key lessons that you’ve learned along the way? What would you tell your early career academic self?

Brooke Griffin  38:54

Another one of my favorite quotes is, “Be yourself. Everyone else is taken.” by Oscar Wilde. And in academia, maybe it’s like this and other pharmacy niches, there’s a very there’s very much a cookie cutter approach to how we do our work, down to how many lecture hours somebody has, how many APPY students somebody takes, the number of courses people are involved in. There’s a model for workload equity that people kind of look the same and do the same things, and even in order to get promoted, the same types of activities are encouraged. It’s hard to think outside of the box, and it’s hard to be that person in academia, and I found myself a square peg trying to fit herself into a round hole in many aspects, in committee meetings, in courses I was involved in in bold ideas that I had that just seemed so completely out of the box that people made it seem like it was unrealistic and unattainable. So I think I would tell myself that you being unique. And bringing your ideas to the table is valuable, and sometimes it takes just finding the right ears and the right support to get there. So if you don’t have an internal mentor, if you don’t see anyone at your institution who kind of gets you, there are so many opportunities to find mentorship in external organizations. Almost every pharmacy org has a mentorship program. So I would say, keep finding to find that career support so that you don’t lose any aspect of your uniqueness.

Tim Ulbrich  40:32

I love that, and it reminds me, Brooke of the visual that came to mind as you’re sharing is that we all, we all have an internal flame that sometimes loses its fire over time, and I think having others around us, mentors, community, colleagues, friends, spouses, whatever that you know, can really help us identify, see that and ignite. Help us reignite that flame is so important. It also reminded me one of my favorite quotes that I listen to every day as a part of a morning affirmation from Rabbi Zusa. It says, “In the coming world, they will not ask me, why were you not Moses? They will ask me, why were you not Zusa?” Goes back to those questions, right? Who are you? What do you want? And what does that? What does that look like? How about on the entrepreneurial side, obviously, more near term journey that you’ve been on. But what are a couple of lessons that you’ve learned thus far along your entrepreneurial journey?

Brooke Griffin  41:27

When I started blogging, and I hit publish on that for the very first time, and I had lived in this academic world for my entire career, when even the good ideas take 18 months to see implementation, and you need a lot of approvals to get things done, to have an idea, to write about it and to hit click and publish and have it go out on social media was incredibly freeing, and as nervous and as scared as I was, and even that very first blog hit some, you know, little controversy that I wasn’t expecting. And I almost shut down the whole thing, but I think I was really nervous about what my colleagues might say the next Monday. Like, What is everyone gonna say about Brooke putting her ideas out there in the world, and now she’s got a blog, and who does she think she is? I probably can count on one hand how many people have asked me about that blog out of all the people that I work with. I think people are assuming that everybody’s kind of watching each other. But what the experts say is true is that everyone is just so laser focused in their own lane that it just really reinforces that we have to do what feels good to us, as long as we’re not harming anybody or saying anything offensive. That you know, if that’s the impact you want to have on the world, it really doesn’t matter what anyone else thinks. I think the other thing, the other big lesson that I had, was being able to embrace the beginner’s mindset. When you’re in academia for so long, you know how to do a lecture. You know how to run a course. You know how to have APPY students. You know how to run a committee. When you start a side hustle or start your entrepreneurial journey, you are learning a new language. You are taking baby steps. You everything seems new and everything seems scary, and being able to embrace that beginner’s mindset again, is something that I really treasure. And there was someone I follow, and she said something like, you’ll never be at this point in your entrepreneurial journey again. This beginning stage is so beautiful, and there’s so much growth that happens. You know, from zero to your first 100k that’s just so amazing. You’ll never be here again, so cherish all of the ups and downs and the good and the bad that comes during this time.

Tim Ulbrich  43:46

A lot of wisdom there, and I think the holding the space to allow for the conflicting emotions as you were talking, it reminded me of like the excitement and anticipation that was present with the fear. Both were there. And you even talked about, you didn’t use the words inner critic, but when you were sharing of your own journey and publishing that first blog post, like, pay attention to those voices. I’m not speaking to Brooke. I’m speaking, you know, more broadly. Like, well, that’s interesting. Like, who is that? What are they saying? Where does that come from? And, you know, I think just an awareness and a curiosity to those will really start to unlock and that is one of the most beautiful things of this journey. I always say, second to parenting my four boys, entrepreneurship is challenged me to grow and stretch in ways I could have never imagined. And those have been painful at times, and they’ve been beautiful at times. And I wouldn’t change it for anything, but I think that holding the space for some of that inner awareness as you’re going through not only building whatever you’re building, but also what is the transformation that’s happening inside as well. 

Brooke Griffin  44:56

Well said. 

Tim Ulbrich  44:57

As we wrap up, what is the best place that our listeners can go to connect with you and learn more the about the work that you’re doing. 

Brooke Griffin  45:04

Oh, thank you, Tim. For any listeners who are on Facebook, I have a Facebook group called Bold Idea Group. I post every day at 5am something inspirational, motivational. I’m also publishing the podcast called Today’s Bold Idea three days a week right now, working myself up to daily. My website is boldideagroup.com, and I’ve been fortunate enough to be invited to a couple of colleges of pharmacy and other organizations to even just present some of these ideas about job crafting, speaking to a larger audience. For those of you who aren’t necessarily ready for one on one coaching or group coaching.

Tim Ulbrich  45:40

Awesome. We will link to all those in the show notes, the website, the podcast page, the Facebook group, so that folks can go in and learn more and connect with you. So Brooke, this has been amazing. Speaking of energy filling, it has been that for me. So thank you so much for taking time to come on the show and share your journey with our listeners.

Brooke Griffin  45:58

Thank you so much. Tim, I had a great time.

Tim Ulbrich  46:02

Before we wrap up today’s show, I want to again thank this week’s sponsor of the Your Financial Pharmacist podcast, First Horizon. We’re glad to have found a solution for pharmacists that are unable to save 20% for a down payment on a home. A lot of pharmacists in the YFP community have taken advantage of First Horizon’s pharmacist home loan, which requires a 3% down payment for a single family home or townhome for first time homebuyers and has no PMI on a 30-year fixed rate mortgage. To learn more about the requirements for First Horizon’s pharmacist home loan, and to get started with the pre-approval process, you can visit yourfinancialpharmacist.com, /home-loan. Again, that’s yourfinancialpharmacist.com/home-loan. 

Tim Ulbrich  46:45

As we conclude this week’s podcast, an important reminder that the content on this show is provided to you for informational purposes only and is not intended to provide and should not be relied on for investment or any other advice. Information in the podcast and corresponding materials should not be construed as a solicitation or offer to buy or sell any investment or related financial products. We urge listeners to consult with a financial advisor with respect to any investment. Furthermore, the information contained in our archive, newsletters, blog posts and podcasts is not updated and may not be accurate at the time you listen to it on the podcast. Opinions and analyzes expressed herein are solely those of Your Financial Pharmacist, unless otherwise noted, and constitute judgments as of the dates published. Such information may contain forward looking statements which are not intended to be guarantees of future events. Actual results could differ materially from those anticipated in the forward looking statements. For more information, please visit yourfinancialpharmacist.com/disclaimer, Thank you again for your support of the Your Financial Pharmacist podcast. Have a great rest of your week.

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