YFP 098: Lifestyle Creep: The #1 Threat to Growing Your Net Worth

Lifestyle Creep: The #1 Threat to Growing Your Net Worth

Tim Baker, Tim Church and Tim Ulbrich talk through avoiding lifestyle creep, a simple but powerful philosophy for achieving wealth.

Summary

Tim Baker, Tim Church and Tim Ulbrich are in-person due to a quarterly YFP retreat for the recording of this episode. They talk about how to avoid lifestyle creep, something many new practitioners face.

Tim Church begins the episode by sharing an anecdote of a coworker, Serena. Serena was a residency trained pharmacist who had a great career, as well as a side job, and made $140,000 a year. She drove a Mercedes Benz, had a nice house, went on the best vacations, and ate at nice restaurants. It appeared like Serena had everything together financially, but she expressed to Tim Church that she was going into foreclosure on her home. When her hours were cut from her second job, she couldn’t pay all of her bills.

Tim Baker dives into becoming balance sheet affluent instead of income affluent. Income affluent means that your salary or income is good, but the money that comes in goes right back out. He explains that many pharmacists have the notion that because they will be making 6 figures, they don’t have anything to worry about in regards to their debt. However, a shift to being balance sheet affluent must occur, meaning growing your assets and net worth.

Tim Ulbrich explains that there are two reasons pharmacists feel like they are living paycheck to paycheck, despite making a great income. Lifestyle creep is a main reason and is caused by present bias and comparison to others. Present bias, as Tim Church explains, refers to the tendency to favor what is happening today or tomorrow versus several years from now. Tim Baker sees present bias affecting clients as it’s hard to picture yourself 10, 20 or 30 years older, but stresses the importance of placing yourself on a success timeline to envision what success looks like to you in the future. To combate present bias, things like automation can be effective.

The other factor affecting lifestyle creep is comparison to others. Tim Ulbrich explains that this can be subtle, but it’s impactful. Some items or experiences will temporarily bring you happiness, but it’s important to look at what a wealthy life is to you and work toward that without trying to be or emulate what you see others purchasing or doing.

Mentioned on the Show

• Airbnb
• 7 Figure Pharmacist by Tim Church, PharmD and Tim Ulbrich, PharmD
• The Millionaire Next Door: The Surprising Secrets of America’s Wealthy by Thomas J. Stanley and William D. Danko
• The Next Millionaire Next Door: Enduring Strategies for Building Wealth by Thomas J. Stanley and Sarah Stanley Fallaw Ph.D
• YFP Planning
• Switch: How to Change Things When Change is Hard by Chip Heath and Dan Heath
• YFP 057: The Power of Automating Your Financial Plan
• Join the YFP Community

Episode Transcript

Tim Ulbrich: Hey, what’s up, everybody? Welcome to this week’s episode of the Your Financial Pharmacist podcast, episode 098. We’re two episodes away from episode 100. We’ve got some exciting things planned, which is going to be a lot of fun. But here we are, live in Columbus, Ohio, at the Ulbrich household. We’re going to talk about avoiding lifestyle creep, what we think is the #1 barrier to new pharmacy graduates achieving long-term financial wealth. So what’s it like? Here we are, Columbus, Ohio, live in person.

Tim Baker: Yeah, checking out the new digs since you moved to Ohio State. So last time, we were in Rootstown, Ohio.

Tim Church: Wait. Correction. It’s The Ohio State.

Tim Ulbrich: Oh boy.

Tim Baker: Sorry. I am a Buckeye fan, so I should know better. Yeah, I mean, lots going on. I feel like every time, every time we get together, and we get together — what? Quarterly? There’s just so much to talk about, so much to do. Just a lot of juice and buzz around I think kind of where the brand is headed and yeah, I always get so jacked up about meeting with you guys.

Tim Ulbrich: I think it’s going to be a fun episode. And we’ve got a great one coming for you next week as well. We’re going to talk about financial moves that we think every new pharmacy graduate should be making. Great time of year, obviously, graduation right around the corner. But here, we’re going to talk about this idea of avoiding lifestyle creep. But also, we have to mention, this is the first time we’re doing some video on the podcast as well. So while we haven’t yet done so, make sure to check our brand new YouTube. I don’t know if we even have a subscriber yet, but we’re going to build that up over time.

Tim Church: I don’t think we have any.

Tim Ulbrich: So you’ll be seeing more video from us, that’s a Tim Church goal in 2019. And so here we are, in person, live in video. I kind of feel like an old man a little bit, not going to lie. I think it’s — Joe Rogan and Elon Musk are smoking weed on their podcasts. And we’re drinking coffee like old men.

Tim Church: From a Dr. Juice mug.

Tim Ulbrich: Yes, from a Dr. Juice mug. Yes.

Tim Baker: Mine has brown in it. Brown coffee. Not brown liquor.

Tim Ulbrich: Alright, so Tim Church, let’s start about just this concept of barriers to a net worth mindset. And as we think about avoiding lifestyle creep, and I think in the book “Seven Figure Pharmacist,” you had a really neat story that really highlighted and I think sets a tone for this topic, and that was about a pharmacist named Serena. So tell us a little bit more about Serena and some of the background and into the concept of lifestyle creep.

Tim Church: Sure. So when we talked in the book about Serena, she was a pharmacist in her 30s, and she was doing extremely well in her career. She was residency-trained, had an amazing job, and she even had a side job working at another pharmacy. So she was making a lot of money. She was making about $140,000 a year, and that was even a couple years ago, which was way beyond what the median pharmacist’s salary was. So if you look at kind of her lifestyle and what she had going on, she drove a really nice car. I think she had a Mercedes Benz. She had a nice house, and she always dressed well, went on the best vacations, went out to nice restaurants. So on the outside, it really looked like she had everything together with her financial picture. But the reality was is that one day, she knew I was working with some personal finance and working with YFP, and she asked to talk to me about her personal situation. And basically what she expressed to me was that she was going to go in foreclosure with her home. And I just let that sink in for a minute. I just thought, wow. She’s making $140,000 a year. She’s a pharmacist, so obviously she’s very intelligent, knows a lot about pharmacy. But she didn’t really know that much about personal finance. And she was in a situation when her second job hours were cut, she was no longer able to make all of the payments that she had. She not only had a mortgage, but she had student loans, she had credit cards, she had her car payment. So she had all these payments going on, and then basically once that job was gone, she wasn’t able to make those.

Tim Ulbrich: So Tim Baker, when I hear that story of Serena, I think of “The Millionaire Next Door” and “The Next Millionaire Next Door,” you know, in their most recent book, really outlines this concept of being income affluent versus balance sheet affluent. And when I hear Serena’s story, which is true I think for many pharmacists — no judgment, something that I struggled with as well — but making a good income but is that income actually converting into long-term financial success? So tell us a little bit about that concept of income affluence relative to balance sheet affluence.

Tim Baker: Yeah. So I mean, I guess the first thing when I hear a story like that is that I look at Serena’s case, and even though she’s in a tough situation, I respect the fact that for a very intimate subject like finance, that you’re willing to lay the cards on the table and be vulnerable. In a position like a pharmacist or someone who is very highly educated, sometimes, it’s really hard to like say, “I don’t really know what I’m doing,” or “Maybe the people or ideas that I’ve surrounded myself with aren’t necessarily the right way to go about it.” So one of the things that I really try to impress upon clients is really shifting that mindset from income statement affluent to balance sheet affluent. So essentially, you know, in the case of Serena, the income statement affluent, that would describe her, someone who the top line revenue is coming in. $140,000, we understand that that’s well above the average household income in the United States. But nothing’s sticking. It’s all a sieve. You know, the money that comes in goes right out. So — and I think part of the problem that we see from the issues that we see is that pharmacists buy into that. It’s like, hey, my worries are going to be all gone when I start making that income, and I have nothing to worry about. And I think one of the things that we are trying to key in on is the well, not so fast — if I use my Lee Corso impression — not so fast with that. So I think it’s shifting the mindset to balance sheet affluent where, you know, money comes in. Income is the lifeblood of the financial plan. But what actually sticks is growing those assets and minimizing those liabilities and growing that net worth over time so the balance sheet grows over time instead of money coming right in and right out. So I think having that mindset — and I’ve seen clients that make $140,000, $240,000, and be very much income statement affluent where it goes in and it goes right out, and I’ve seen clients that make $40,000 or $50,000 and be wealthier relative to that comparison because they just get the fact that hey, I’m going to pay myself first. I’m not going to take on consumer debt, which is very predatory. I’m going to be intentional about my student debt. So I think it’s a mindset that we’ll probably talk about FOMO and YOLO a little bit later. It’s so hard to, you know, not compare yourself to others and think that that’s normal. And you know, “The Millionaire Next Door,” when he studies millionaires, the millionaires aren’t the people you would think are millionaires. A lot of that consumerism, it’s really facade. It’s a house of cards, Tim Church. So you know, it’s important to be aware of that.

Tim Ulbrich: Yeah, this hits home for me. As I think back to the journey Jess and I took is 2012 was really the pivot year for us. I graduated in 2008, did a residency in 2009. 2012, as I look back on that journey, had earned about $500,000 of income, but I had a net worth of -$225,000. I mean, it’s just a classic example of income’s coming in the door, but it’s not being converted.

Tim Baker: Right.

Tim Ulbrich: And we talk about this all the time on the podcast, when we’re doing presentations, a pharmacist’s income is an incredible tool. But that tool has to be put to work towards paying down your debts, growing your long-term savings, building income protection plan, and certainly lifestyle creep and what we’re talking about here today I think plays so much into that.

Tim Church: And I think what we are talking about is it’s going to be normal coming out of pharmacy school for most people to have a negative net worth. I mean, that’s, unfortunately, the reality for most people when they start out. But I think what’s more important is looking at that and looking at the change over time. You know, how much year to year is that net worth growing, trying to get to the balance sheet affluence?

Tim Ulbrich: Yeah, and that’s one of the things I like when we talk about the financial plan with you, Tim Baker, is net worth is top of mind all the time, right? So I know when Jess and I log onto the platform that you use, front and center, net worth, what’s growing over time? And I think that that’s a great indicator of your overall financial health.

Tim Baker: When we were tooling around Columbus today, I kind of went on a big rant, so there’s Tim Ulbrich in the driver’s seat, Tim Church in the passenger seat, and Tim Baker in the back like a little kid ranting. I’m like, “Why don’t more financial planners look at net worth? Like why isn’t that a thing?” And I think it’s because the industry is so focused on product and investments and things like that that it’s — I don’t get it. It was kind of a rant that I was going on. I don’t understand why that isn’t more of a measurement that financial planners use to help clients show progress and really value. I don’t know — to me, again, income is — our jam at YFP Planning is really how can we help you, the client, grow and protect income, which is the lifeblood of the financial plan, and grow and protect net worth, which is what sticks, while keeping your goals in mind? And to me, like anything outside of that, like I don’t get. Investments and insurance, it’s important, but it’s part of what feeds into all that. So yeah. Rant over.

Tim Ulbrich: That was a rant. And you know, normally I have three kids ranting in the back of my minivan. And today, it was Tim Baker ranting in the back of the car.

Tim Baker: Yeah, sorry about that.

Tim Ulbrich: So Tim Church, let’s talk about Parkinson’s law because I think that’s so much of this concept of lifestyle creep is Parkinson’s law. So what is that? And how does that play into pharmacists and ultimately, this concept here?

Tim Church: So this is a well known principal, and it’s been applied to many different areas. But initially, this was expressed as essentially, the work will expand for the amount that you have available. In other words, however long you have to get a task or something done, that’s how long it’s going to take. And I think probably many pharmacists and students out there can relate to that based on when you have an exam or when you have an assignment or a project due that sometimes, people will procrastinate. That’s just human behavior to normally do that. But the reality is that concept and that principal has been applied to many other areas. It’s been applied to eating and even whatever is on your plate or whatever you have in front of you, that’s what you’re going to eat.

Tim Baker: Small plates versus big plates.

Tim Church: Yeah. I think there was actually a study in I think it’s the book “Switch” by Dan and Chip Heath, and they talked about, they were doing an experiment about people going to the movie theater. And they wanted to see what their behavior was based on how much popcorn they gave them. And what they found was they gave people old popcorn, fresh popcorn and it didn’t even matter. It mattered how much they actually put in the size of the bucket in terms of how much they had to eat. But I think that concept really is exactly what we’re talking about here is that lifestyle creep is that tendency to spend whatever you make and even go above and beyond that. And I think that’s where we see a lot of famous people out there that they’re even in really high amounts of debt, despite making millions or even billions.

Tim Baker: Expenses rise to the level of your income. Right? So and I think we see this in lottery winners too is a lot of people will say, “Oh, I wish I made — my worries would be over if I could make 25% more.” But the science says that you’re going to spend 25% more. We see it even with tax refunds. Some people spend that even before it comes in the door. So you know, and this is why when we go through the foundation of the financial plan, it’s like, this is why budgeting is so important because we have kind of limits. We have a plan. It’s not intentional. I know that we’re talking about the podcast and coming up on episode 100, Parkinson’s Law was real for me to get the podcast edited early on. If I knew that we had a Thursday deadline, and I was running around with my hair on fire with clients and things like that, I would take all that time, sometimes more if you go back. Now we have Caitlyn, who’s awesome and keeps us on deadline.

Tim Ulbrich: Rockstar.

Tim Baker: But yeah, it’s a real thing. It’s absolutely a real thing.

Tim Ulbrich: And I think this really speaks to probably one of the most common things that we hear is “I feel like I’m living paycheck to paycheck, despite making a great income.” And you know, that’s getting pressed even further right now as we see some salary compression happening, the job market shifting a little bit, and so obviously lifestyle creep I think is more relevant than ever to pharmacists today and to pharmacy graduates today. So we’re hoping to capture those that are getting ready to graduate here in the next month, those that are still out even transitioning, never too late, but trying to do everything you can to lower those expenses and prevent that creep. So really, two big reasons why lifestyle creep occurs: present bias and the comparison to others. Let’s talk first about present bias. What is that concept? And how does that relate to lifestyle creep?

Tim Church: So present bias is really the tendency to favor what is happening today versus what is happening tomorrow or several years down the road. There’s a concept that’s also been described as hyperbolic discounting where we discount things that are going to happen in the future or that we anticipate that are going to happen. So it sort of makes sense that we want to enjoy ourselves today, whether that be with clothes, with purchases, with going out to eat. That’s the reality of kind of what’s happening there.

Tim Ulbrich: So Tim Baker, from the financial planning perspective, the concept of present bias, I mean, how do you see this play into reality each and every day while you’re working on a client with the financial plan? And what are some of the strategies that you use in helping them combat some of the aspects?

Tim Baker: Yeah, so you know, it’s so hard for us to really empathize with or really even picture our 30-year-older self. Right? So it’s hard for us to kind of get into that mindset. So one of the things when we talk about goals is really to lay out like what’s the path? What’s the success timeline, we call it? So Tim Church, you’re my client, I say, “Hey, Tim Church. What I want you to do is let’s get into my imaginary time machine.” So we get into the Delorean and we hit the dial for April 2021. We get out of the Delorean, you’re two year older, you’re two years wiser. What does success look like? And you know, we do that for five years, we do that for 10 years. And it’s hard. And at first, when I would do this practice, it’s like pulling teeth almost. It’s just hard for us. And the further out we get, the more it’s like that image of ourselves fades. I can envision myself at — let’s see, I’m 36 — I can envision myself at 38. Can I envision myself at 41? Maybe. At 46? No. But that’s kind of the exercise that I started to do is I would start to put you in that age. So I would say, you know, now you’re 10 years older and 10 years wiser. And at 46, these are all the things that kind of come into my mind that I want to achieve. So I kind of backwards plan it, and I try to transport you into that time and place. But it’s hard. It’s hard. And the further out it is, the more that we discount it. And I feel like what I say is, again, we’re trying to help grow and protect income, grow and protect net worth, while keeping your goals in mind. And if we don’t feel the push and pull between taking care of yourself today and your 30-year-older self, we’re probably doing something wrong. So it can’t just be about pedal to the metal, spend, spend, spend today, and we’ll just worry about it later on.

Tim Ulbrich: Absolutely.

Tim Baker: But it also can’t be stick your head and achieve a $10 million net worth for a purpose without enjoying your boys growing up or whatever that is. So it’s threading that needle, and how do you do that?

Tim Church: Well, that’s what I was going to ask you. So when you’re walking through this exercise with your clients, you know, obviously this is one of the biggest points that comes up with how you manage your money, right? Because these decisions, these micro-decisions that are being made are having a compound effect over time. So when you’re assessing clients’ situations, how do you ensure that both of those things are happening simultaneously?

Tim Baker: I think at the end of the day, it’s just asking good questions and getting the (bleep) out of the way. In reality, I joke around about that. But I think that’s what it is and really have the client or clients kind of have a period of self-discovery. And sometimes it’s not like a “Eureka!” moment. It’s a process. It’s a conversation. It’s, “Hey, we kind of left it at this. Did you guys mull it around? Where are we at with it? What’s the update?” And I think having a forum, an open forum for partners or really one-on-one to be able to talk through those issues becomes, it lays out a path for you. But it’s not like — it’s the same thing as like, should I invest? Or should I pay down debt? It depends. It’s kind of the same thing. And it’s a process. And you know, it’s not going to be a binary, this is what you should do.

Tim Church: Right. And I think that that’s one of the key concepts is that a lot of these things in terms of whatever the financial position one is currently in at the moment could be a culmination of habits that have manifested over time.

Tim Baker: Right. Compound effect.

Tim Ulbrich: Absolutely.

Tim Church: So it’s not just the individual decisions that come up. I mean, somebody could be used to spending x amount on restaurants, on clothes and things like that, month after month after month, and that’s just kind of the normal. And I’m sure that that’s probably sometimes hard to discuss with clients that you have to really take a hard look at that budget and what percentage of that is going towards your net worth?

Tim Ulbrich: Yeah, and I think this is a good time too to talk about what can you do to be combating present bias, right? What can you be doing in your plan each and every month to actually take some steps forward if this is something that you’re struggling with? And I think for me, this comes to the concept of automation a little bit in your financial plan.

Tim Baker: Yeah, get out of your own way.

Tim Ulbrich: Yeah, get out of your own way. And when I think about — there’s just a natural human behavior that if you go out and spend money, name the thing you like to enjoy, it’s a rush, right? I mean, I love buying books. I love shopping. I love doing lots of things. And that is things that you get positive feelings. That is a natural human behavior. Me stashing away an amount of money for 40 years in the future in my 401k, like dopamine surge does not happen, right? It’s just not as exciting. I mean, there’s maybe a few people that are listening —

Tim Baker: But isn’t that the one example, though, where it’s fairly automated for everyone? Especially with auto-enroll these days. Because that’s what I was just thinking when you brought that up is when you talked about automation, for most people, when they start a job these days and they have a 401k, their employer is going to automatically enroll them into a 401k. So you are completely on the sideline. You really don’t have to do anything. You don’t even have to pick the investment. You’re probably going to be defaulted into a target fund. So the fact that you’re kind of sitting on the sidelines, but then you wake up in five years, and there’s $100,000 there or whatever it is, like that’s kind of what we’re talking about. But to do it even more deeply in your financial plan with regard to other types of savings. That’s what it is. I mean, that’s a perfect example of getting out of your own way. You know, it’s so true with a lot of parts of the financial plan, sometimes, the more you tinker, the more that you screw it up.

Tim Ulbrich: Yeah, and I think this is — we talked about this in Episode 057, so for those that want to go back and listen.

Tim Church: How do you remember these episodes?

Tim Ulbrich: I don’t know, I spent a little bit of time memorizing them.

Tim Baker: I don’t.

Tim Ulbrich: Yeah, episode 057 on automation and we have a blog post on it as well. But for those of you that want to think about how to automate the plan and what that could look like, and we talk about sinking funds and buckets, but I think the essence of it is get out of your way. Set the plan, be intentional, and get out of the way.

Tim Church: Yeah, you have to protect yourself from yourself.

Tim Ulbrich: Absolutely. Absolutely.

Tim Baker: Yep.

Tim Ulbrich: So present bias, No. 1. The second thing is this concept of comparing to others. So not a new concept, comparing yourself with neighbors, keeping up with the Joneses, you name it. Obviously, I think for pharmacists, that’s a very real thing. So Tim Baker, talk to me about that. Is that something you see with clients? This comparison to other pharmacists or peers and this need to keep up financially in whatever way?

Tim Baker: Yeah, I think so. You know, it might not be as overt of like, hey, my buddy just got this car. I want one too. But I think it’s always there. I mean, comparison is the enemy of content. So I think any time that you’re not doing you, and you’re worried about what everyone else is doing — I sound like my dad — you’re going to run into some problems. Because there’s always going to be someone out there that’s more athletic than you, taller than you, smarter than you. And I think if you get caught up in that, you know, you’re never going to be satisfied. And it’s so true with money as well. And the problem is in a world where we’re so connected with social media and we’re running our highlights on Twitter and Facebook and Instagram, it’s a problem because we want to — there’s the Fear of Missing Out and You Only Live Once and all those concepts which you want to make sure that you’re living an enriched life, but you want to make sure you’re living your wealthy life, which sounds cliche, but maybe for some people, traveling the world is not a thing that they really aspire to. Or maybe someone doesn’t want to retire at age 50 or whatever it is or buy a luxury car. But sometimes, we get caught up in what everyone’s doing, and our own values, our own beliefs depend on — what is the saying? Like you’re the average of the five people that are closest to you. And you know, they obviously are going to affect your exercise habits, your eating habits, your spending habits. And I think those are just things to be hyper-aware of because the reality is, again, to go back to it, the people that from a financial perspective, that are typically the wealthiest and most content are socially indifferent to those things. And it’s one of the things that, you know, as a wealth-building factor for “Millionaire Next Door” is they can — I’m going to say it again — they could give a (bleep) what you’re driving, where you’re going, that type of thing. And they’re focused on their own financial plan and their own vision of what a wealthy life is, and that’s it.

Tim Church: And I think one of the biggest misconceptions is that sometimes when we play that out and we have that comparison to others and what they’re doing, is that we think to ourselves that if we are able to do some of these things that other people are doing, to buy these purchases, to go on these vacations, that that’s automatically going to increase happiness level. And I think that’s the biggest misnomer that comes along with it. Now, of course, some of those things will, and it may be a temporary boost in happiness, but it may not be exactly what you were looking for.

Tim Baker: Yeah, and I think the other thing to is I see is pharmacists or young couples will come to me, and I’ll say, oftentimes when the pharmacist speaks with me, they share that they’re overwhelmed with student debt or some other type of debt. And they’re like, yeah, that’s me. And they start to like tiptoe into how much they actually owe. And I’m like, “Hit me with it. I’ve seen it all. So just tell me.” And you know, it might be like between the two of them, they might have $400,000 in debt. And when I — so I’m taking notes, and I write it down, and I think they’re waiting for a reaction. And I’m not going to give it to them. But what I say to them after we kind of go through the conversation about the debt and how they feel about it is, I say, “In a way, it’s all relative.” Because I have some clients that come on, and they have $800,000 in debt. I have some that come on that have $0, and they actually have a positive net worth. And I think that goes into this is like, if you’re comparing yourself to others — and you know, not everyone is in the same place financially. But we want to put ourselves there, and I think it’s just really, in my opinion, it’s really sitting down and asking yourself, what truly is a wealthy life? Not what your parents think, not what your neighbor thinks. Like what do you think is a wealthy life? And work towards that. Be intentional about that. And you know, it’s something that we tell Olivia, like why did you do this at school? And she’s like, “Well, it’s because everyone else was doing it.” And I’m like, “No, bro. Like come on.”

Tim Ulbrich: That’s not a good reason.

Tim Baker: Yeah. That’s not a thing. So she’s 4, we’re working on it. But it’s a lifelong struggle. Like I do the same thing.

Tim Ulbrich: Yeah. Absolutely.

Tim Baker: Small business owner, like I want to make sure the business is growing and have the things that owning your business affords, but it’s also like when you go down that path, you’re like, I’ve got to stop. Because it’s not productive.

Tim Ulbrich: Well, and I think it can be so subtle, and I think the impact of it happening can be subconscious. And you know, like what you said, just a reminder of we tend to follow the behaviors and patterns of those that we’re closest with, you know, your inner circle. And really taking a step back to say, is that true for you? And are you aware of that and what’s happening? So really evaluating the impact of your neighborhood and evaluating the impact of your coworkers and your friends. And changing the point of comparison. I was talking with the students last week at Ohio State, and I think often in the pharmacy profession, it’s very easy to play the pharmacist-to-pharmacist peer comparison game. And you see this so much with residency. You know, “Hey, I’m making $45,000 in residency. And my friend I sat next to for three years in therapeutics is making $120,000. Life sucks, so I’m just going to keep riding my loans out, and I’ll work on it in five years and kind of woe is me.” But I think if you take a step back, you know, the median household income in the United States for a family of four is about $55,000 a year. So if you’re a resident, single, making $45,000, and you change that point of perspective, how does that alter how you begin to think about your financial plan each and every week? So finding people that can come around you to encourage you with that, that will be on that journey with you to hold you accountable to live the wealthy life, plan for the future but also have fun today, and maybe that means a financial coach and a planner that can help you along in that journey as well. But I think the point is certainly real.

Tim Baker: And I think that’s where we hopefully think that YFP fits. You know, we talk about empowering a community, surrounding yourself with like-minded people. That’s what we want this community to be is that, you know, kind of example of like, hey, there’s other people like me that are struggling with a question about their finances or just the direction in general. And I think that’s healthy conversation, that’s productive conversation, and I think being open — and really, I think one of the things you said is how do you combat it? It’s almost like challenge everything. When we talk with clients that have more or less a spending problem and their credit card, challenge every assumption. We live in a society that’s like, well, I need this. I need that. And like do you? Do you really need it? So challenge it from the bottom up. Obviously, we need clothing and housing and food and all that kind of stuff, but I think approaching it from a very basic level and then working from there is a good way to approach it.

Tim Ulbrich: And I think hearing you talk about community is a great reminder of just what we’re trying to do is empower and build a community that is helping one another. And to be honest, without getting too sentimental, we’re going to talk about this in Episode 100, but that is what is most rewarding for us is seeing that community thrive and help one another. So if you’re not yet a part of the Your Financial Pharmacist Facebook group, please join us. We’d love to have you in the community. And we certainly think you have something to offer to our community. But we hope that that group is there for you as well. Before we wrap up, just a reminder, if you like what you heard on this week’s episode or you’ve been following the podcast for some time, please head on over to iTunes or wherever you listen to your podcasts each and every week and leave us a review. We’d love to get your feedback and a comment as well. And again, next week, we’re going to come back and talk about financial moves that we think the pharmacy graduate should be making and things to be looking out for, and then we’ll be following that up with episode 100. Have a great rest of your week.

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